Interview with Ross Solly, ABC Radio Canberra

Event: Interview with Ross Solly, ABC Radio Canberra
Date: 15 July 2024, 8:40am AEST
Speakers: Denita Wawn, Chief Executive Master Builders Australia
Topics: CFMEU investigation

E&OE

Ross Solly, ABC Radio Canberra: I mentioned earlier on the show some more unbelievable allegations surrounding the CFMEU and the way that it operates. Allegations of corruption of heavy, heavy handedness. And the Minister, Tony Burke, says he is considering deregistering the construction division of the CFMEU. Denita Wawn is the chief executive officer with Master Builders Australia and joins us on the program. Denita thanks for your time this morning.

Denita Wawn, CEO Master Builders Australia: Good morning, Ross.

Ross: Ah, unbelievable. Some of the allegations we’re seeing, what do you make of it all?

Denita: None of it surprising to us, unfortunately, we’ve known about this for decades. It’s the reason why Master Builders has lobbied for decades for a special building regulator. The government got rid of the ABCC. But this is broader than just an ABCC. It is about the need for additional resources for police. It’s about anti-competitive behaviour that requires additional resourcing for the ACCC, the list goes on. It is something that our members are dealing with day after day. And we are very glad that this has now been exposed the way it has been.

Ross: You say you’ve known about it for decades, why haven’t governments acted on this before now?

Denita: Well, they have Ross, we had a Royal Commission into trade unions that provided a series of recommendations at the end of 2015. Some of those were implemented by the then Turnbull government. They were dismantled, predominantly, by the existing Albanese government. And as such, we have been left unchecked, in terms of the way in which the rampant alleged criminal behaviour has been increasing over that period of time. And when police are given not enough resources, when regulators are not given enough resources and you dismantle regulators, this is what unfortunately occurs, and of course, our members are too scared to provide evidence to the remaining regulators because they are fearful for retribution. And as such, there is no protection for them.

Ross: So, what needs to change then for your members to now come forward? I mean, obviously that threats always going to be hanging over them.

Denita: Well, we believe that there’s three key elements that urgently need to be implemented. There must be a joint strike force for police that is correctly resourced through state and territory and federal jurisdictions. There needs to be an ACCC review into anti-competitive behaviour, and urgent laws need to be introduced in the coming spring sittings, that give our members protection when they provide evidence, but also gives powers for the Fair Work Ombudsman to review officials and unions if they have a recidivist behaviour. At the moment, the only way, you talked earlier about deregistration, our understanding is the only way you can deregister the CFMEU, is to introduce special legislation, as Bob Hawke did all those years ago with the BLF.

Ross: Well, I think there’ll be no doubt that they, if the government chooses to go down that path, it will get plenty of support from the conservative side of politics, won’t it?

Denita: Well, it will. But the concern that we’ve got is that if you deregister, what comes next? And that is a discussion we’re going to have to have with the federal government-

Ross: Well, what would you like to see, what would you like to see come next? What needs to replace the construction division of the CFMEU?

Denita: Our view is that there are some good people in the CFMEU but there’s a lot of bad eggs. And so, our view is that you take away officials’ rights as being an official if they are recidivist in their behaviour. And you actually get a culture in there that is consistent with other unions. I think this is disappointing for other unions. They must be really lamenting this this morning.

Ross: John Setka, who has been getting a lot of headlines lately, he resigned on Friday on the eve of some of these stories hitting the media. He’s most likely replacement is a chap by the name of Derek Christopher, do you have any faith in Derek Christopher providing a breath of fresh air to the CFMEU?

Denita: I don’t think current leadership, particularly in Victoria, Tas and New South Wales, we would feel confident in until such time as there has been appropriate reviews and there has been a change in direction. This is a union where their leaders disregard the law until such time as you get new leaders in there, that understand or respect the law and operate within the law, then we will very be very sceptical of any leadership changes at the top.

Ross: So, Derek Christopher is not the man for the job?

Denita: Well, I haven’t dealt personally with Derek Christopher, so the jury is out but let’s just say the evidence would say that we need to be sceptical of any changes in leadership with people that have been around the leadership of John Setka for the period of time they have.

Ross: Good to chat with you this morning, Denita, thank you.

Denita: Thanks Ross.

Ross: Denita Wawn, who is the Chief Executive Officer of Master Builders Australia.

Media contact:
Dee Zegarac
National Director, Media & Public Affairs
0400 493 071
dee.zegarac@masterbuilders.com.au